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Shabbat 81a

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Babylonian Talmud · folio map

Shabbat 81a

Shabbat 81a. The full printed text of this folio side — 10 numbered segments, about 354 words — with the classic commentaries printed on the page.

Original text

Segment 1

מַתְנִי׳ עֶצֶם כְּדֵי לַעֲשׂוֹת תַּרְווֹד. רַבִּי יְהוּדָה אוֹמֵר: כְּדֵי לַעֲשׂוֹת מִמֶּנּוּ חָף. זְכוּכִית — כְּדֵי לִגְרוֹר בָּהּ רֹאשׁ הַכַּרְכֵּר. צְרוֹר אוֹ אֶבֶן — כְּדֵי לִזְרוֹק בָּעוֹף. רַבִּי אֶלְעָזָר בַּר יַעֲקֹב אוֹמֵר: כְּדֵי לִזְרוֹק בַּבְּהֵמָה.

MISHNA: The measure that determines liability for carrying out a bone is equivalent to that which is used to make a spoon. Rabbi Yehuda says: In a measure equivalent to that which is used to make from it a key. The measure that determines liability for carrying out glass is equivalent to that which is used to scrape and smooth the top of a bobbin, a sharpened stick used by weavers. The measure that determines liability for carrying out a pebble or a stone is equivalent to that which is used to throw at a bird to chase it away. Rabbi Elazar bar Ya’akov says: Equivalent to that which is used to throw at an animal, which is larger.

Segment 2

גְּמָ׳ לְמֵימְרָא דְּשִׁיעוּרָא דְרַבִּי יְהוּדָה נְפִישׁ? הָא קַיְימָא לַן דְּשִׁיעוּרָא דְרַבָּנַן נְפִישׁ! אָמַר עוּלָּא: חֲפֵי פּוֹתַחַת. תָּנוּ רַבָּנַן: חֲפֵי פּוֹתַחַת טְהוֹרִין, קְבָעָן בַּפּוֹתַחַת טְמֵאִין. וְשֶׁל גַּל, אַף עַל פִּי שֶׁחִיבְּרָן בַּדֶּלֶת וּקְבָעָן בְּמַסְמְרִים טְהוֹרִין — שֶׁכׇּל הַמְחוּבָּר לַקַּרְקַע הֲרֵי הוּא כַּקַּרְקַע.

GEMARA: The Gemara asks: Is that to say that the measure of Rabbi Yehuda is greater? Don’t we maintain that the measure of the Rabbis is greater? Ulla said: Rabbi Yehuda did not refer to the entire key, but to the teeth of a key. With regard to the above, the Gemara cites that which the Sages taught in a baraita : The teeth of a key are ritually pure, and they cannot become impure when separate from the key, as they have no function on their own. However, if one affixed them to a key, they can become ritually impure as part of a utensil. And teeth of a lock, even though one attached them to the door and affixed them with nails, are ritually pure, as anything attached to the ground has the same legal status as the ground itself, which cannot become ritually impure.

Segment 3

זְכוּכִית כְּדֵי לִגְרוֹר בָּהּ. תָּנָא: סְכוּכִית — כְּדֵי לִפְצוֹעַ בָּהּ שְׁנֵי נִימִין כְּאַחַת.

We learned in the mishna: The measure that determines liability for carrying out glass is equivalent to that which is used to scrape and smooth the top of a bobbin. A tanna taught that halakha in a Tosefta in a different manner: The measure that determines liability for carrying out glass is equivalent to that which is used to cut two threads at once, as a glass shard can be used in place of a knife.

Segment 4

צְרוֹר אוֹ אֶבֶן כְּדֵי לִזְרוֹק בָּעוֹף. רַבִּי אֶלְעָזָר כּוּ׳. אָמַר רַבִּי יַעֲקֹב אָמַר רַבִּי יוֹחָנָן: וְהוּא שֶׁמַּרְגֶּשֶׁת בָּהּ. וְכַמָּה שִׁיעוּרוֹ? תַּנְיָא, רַבִּי אֶלְעָזָר בֶּן יַעֲקֹב אוֹמֵר: מִשְׁקַל עֲשָׂרָה זוּז.

We learned in the mishna: The measure that determines liability for carrying out a pebble or a stone is equivalent to that which is used to throw at a bird to chase it away. Rabbi Elazar ben Ya’akov says: Equivalent to that which is used to throw at an animal. Rabbi Ya’akov said that Rabbi Yoḥanan said: And that is only if the stone is large enough that the animal feels it. And how much is the measure of that stone? It was taught in a baraita : Rabbi Elazar ben Ya’akov says: A weight of ten zuz .

Segment 5

זוּנִין עַל לְבֵי מִדְרְשָׁא, אֲמַר לְהוּ: רַבּוֹתַי, אֲבָנִים שֶׁל בֵּית הַכִּסֵּא שִׁיעוּרָן בְּכַמָּה? אָמְרוּ לוֹ: כְּזַיִת כֶּאֱגוֹז וּכְבֵיצָה. אֲמַר לְהוּ: וְכִי טוּרְטָנֵי יַכְנִיס? נִמְנוּ וְגָמְרוּ מְלֹא הַיָּד. תַּנְיָא, רַבִּי יוֹסֵי אוֹמֵר: כְּזַיִת כֶּאֱגוֹז וּכְבֵיצָה. רַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן בְּרַבִּי יוֹסֵי אוֹמֵר מִשּׁוּם אָבִיו: מְלֹא הַיָּד.

The Gemara relates: Zunin entered the study hall and said to the Sages: My teachers, with regard to stones that may be moved on Shabbat for wiping in the bathroom, how much is their measure? They said to him: Stones of only three sizes may be moved for that purpose: An olive-bulk, a nut-bulk, and an egg-bulk. He said to them: And will he take scales [ turtani ] into the bathroom to weigh each stone? They were counted and the Sages concluded that one need not measure the stones. He simply takes a handful of stones. It was taught in a baraita : Rabbi Yosei says the measure of bathroom stones is an olive-bulk, a nut-bulk, and an egg-bulk. Rabbi Shimon, son of Rabbi Yosei, says in the name of his father: One need not measure the stones. He simply takes a handful of stones.

Segment 6

תָּנוּ רַבָּנַן בְּשַׁבָּת: שָׁלֹשׁ אֲבָנִים מְקוּרְזָלוֹת מוּתָּר לְהַכְנִיס לְבֵית הַכִּסֵּא. וְכַמָּה שִׁיעוּרָן? רַבִּי מֵאִיר אוֹמֵר: כֶּאֱגוֹז. רַבִּי יְהוּדָה אוֹמֵר: כְּבֵיצָה. אָמַר רַפְרָם בַּר פָּפָּא אָמַר רַב חִסְדָּא: כַּמַּחֲלוֹקֶת כָּאן כָּךְ מַחֲלוֹקֶת בְּאֶתְרוֹג. הָתָם מַתְנִיתִין, הָכָא בָּרָיְיתָא! אֶלָּא: כַּמַּחֲלוֹקֶת בְּאֶתְרוֹג כָּךְ מַחֲלוֹקֶת כָּאן.

Our Sages taught in a baraita with regard to Shabbat: Three sharpened stones may be taken into the bathroom. And what is their measure? Rabbi Meir says: A nut-bulk; Rabbi Yehuda says: An egg-bulk. Rafram bar Pappa said that Rav Ḥisda said: Like the dispute here, so too, there is a dispute between these Sages with regard to the minimum size of a citron. The Gemara is surprised at the comparison. Why does the Gemara cite this baraita as a mnemonic to recall the dispute about the size of a citron? There, with regard to a citron, it is a mishna that is known by all; here it is a baraita , which is more obscure and more likely to require a mnemonic and a comparison to a more popular source. Rather, the phrasing is reversed: Like the dispute with regard to a citron, so too, there is a dispute here.

Segment 7

אָמַר רַב יְהוּדָה: אֲבָל לֹא אֶת הַפָּאיֵיס. מַאי ״פָּאיֵיס״? אָמַר רַבִּי זֵירָא: כַּרְשִׁינֵי בַּבְלָיָיתָא. אָמַר רָבָא: אָסוּר לְמַשְׁמֵשׁ בִּצְרוֹר בְּשַׁבָּת כְּדֶרֶךְ שֶׁמְּמַשְׁמֵשׁ בַּחוֹל. מַתְקִיף לַהּ מָר זוּטְרָא: לִיסְתַּכַּן? כִּלְאַחַר יָד. אָמַר רַבִּי יַנַּאי: אִם יֵשׁ מָקוֹם קָבוּעַ לְבֵית הַכִּסֵּא — מְלֹא הַיָּד. אִם לָאו — כַּהֶכְרֵעַ מְדוֹכָה קְטַנָּה שֶׁל בְּשָׂמִים. אָמַר רַב שֵׁשֶׁת: אִם יֵשׁ עָלֶיהָ עֵד — מוּתָּר.

Rav Yehuda said: However, one may not move the payis for use in a bathroom. The Gemara asks: What is the meaning of payis ? Rabbi Zeira said: It refers to clods of Babylonian earth, which is soft and flaky. Rava said: It is prohibited to manipulate the anus with a stone on Shabbat to help discharge bodily functions in the manner that one manipulates it on weekdays. Mar Zutra strongly objected to this: According to Rava, should one endanger himself by refraining from relieving himself? The Gemara explains: He meant he should do so in an unusual manner and not in the manner it is typically done. With regard to the size of stones, Rabbi Yannai said: If he has a fixed place for a bathroom, he may take a handful of stones; if he does not need them on Shabbat, he can use them on another occasion. If he does not have a fixed place he may bring in an average size stone, which is the size of a small mortar used for crushing spices. Rav Sheshet said: If the stone has an indication on it that it has already been used in the bathroom, one is permitted to move it for that purpose on Shabbat, regardless of its size.

Segment 8

מֵיתִיבִי? עֲשָׂרָה דְּבָרִים מְבִיאִין אֶת הָאָדָם לִידֵי תַחְתּוֹנִיּוֹת, וְאֵלּוּ הֵן: הָאוֹכֵל עֲלֵי קָנִים, וַעֲלֵי גְפָנִים, וְלוּלַבֵּי גְפָנִים, וּמוֹרִיגֵּי בְהֵמָה בְּלֹא מֶלַח, וְשִׁדְרוֹ שֶׁל דָּג, וְדָג מָלִיחַ שֶׁלֹּא בִּישֵּׁל כׇּל צוֹרְכּוֹ, וְהַשּׁוֹתֶה שִׁמְרֵי יַיִן, וְהַמְקַנֵּחַ בְּסִיד, וּבְחַרְסִית, וְהַמְקַנֵּחַ בִּצְרוֹר שֶׁקִּינַּח בּוֹ חֲבֵרוֹ. וְיֵשׁ אוֹמְרִים: אַף הַתּוֹלֶה עַצְמוֹ בְּבֵית הַכִּסֵּא. לָא קַשְׁיָא: הָא בְּלַח, הָא בְּיָבֵשׁ. וְאִיבָּעֵית אֵימָא: כָּאן מִצַּד אֶחָד, וְכָאן מִשְּׁנֵי צְדָדִין. וְאִיבָּעֵית אֵימָא: הָא דִּידֵיהּ, הָא דְּחַבְרֵיהּ.

The Gemara raises an objection: Is it permitted to wipe with a stone that was already used? Didn’t the Sages say: Ten things bring a person to suffer from hemorrhoids and they are: One who eats the leaves of bulrushes, grape leaves, tendrils of grapevines, the palate and tongue of an animal, as well as any other part of the animal which is not smooth and which has protrusions, without salt, the spine of a fish, a salty fish that is not fully cooked, and one who drinks wine dregs, and one who cleans himself with lime and clay, the materials from which earthenware is made, and one who cleans himself with a stone with which another person has cleaned himself. And some say: One who suspends himself in the bathroom as well. Apparently, using a previously used stone is dangerous to one’s health. The Gemara answers: This is not difficult. Here, where it is prohibited, is referring to a case where the stone is still moist. Here, where it is permitted, is referring to a case where the stone is dry. And if you wish, say instead that here, where it is prohibited, is referring to one side, using the side that was already used; here, where it is permitted, is referring to both sides, using the other side of the same stone. And if you wish, say instead that this, where it is permitted, is referring to one’s own stone, which he used to clean himself; this, where it is prohibited, is referring to another person’s stone, which poses a danger.

Segment 9

אֲמַר לֵיהּ אַבָּיֵי לְרַב יוֹסֵף: יָרְדוּ עָלֶיהָ גְּשָׁמִים וְנִטַּשְׁטְשׁוּ מַהוּ? אֲמַר לֵיהּ: אִם הָיָה רִישּׁוּמָן נִיכָּר — מוּתָּר.

Abaye said to Rav Yosef: What is the ruling if rain fell on the stone and the indications that it had been used previously in the bathroom were obscured? The dilemma is: Is moving it permitted like a stone that is designated for use in the bathroom on Shabbat, or, is moving it prohibited since its indications were obscured and it might have the legal status of set-aside? Rav Yosef said to him: If indication on them is apparent, even though it is partially obscured, it is permitted, since the stone remains clear that it is designated for use in the bathroom.

Segment 10

בְּעָא מִינֵּיהּ רַבָּהּ בַּר רַב שֵׁילָא מֵרַב

Rabba bar Rav Sheila raised a dilemma before Rav

Shabbat 81a

Shabbat 81a

Rashi

Tosafot

Rav Nissim Gaon

Rabbeinu Chananel

Meiri

Maharsha (Chidushei Halachot)

Maharam

Penei Yehoshua

Gilyon HaShas

Chiddushei Rabbi Akiva Eiger

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